Shoji Yamashiro Interview

What follows is a now-deleted interview of Dr. Tsutomu Oohashi, also known as Shoji Yamashiro for a now-defunct music magazine called SUPPLEMENTAL¹⁾. Shoji Yamashiro is the leader of the collective known as Geinoh Yamashirogumi, a world music ensemble composed from people of all walks of life and best known for composing the OST for Akira.

Yamashiro is himself a scientist and has been involved with research of Southeast Asia music and, to very roughly summarize his work, the effects of high-frequency sounds in the human mind. I've always somewhat posited that, between his uncommon scientific research and a (what could be described as very characteristically Japanese) low profile, he carries around with him the slightest notes of a (hopefully benign) cult leader. This interview appears to hint at this a little bit, but it also touches several interesting concepts.

The circumstances in which SUPPLEMENTAL managed to land an interview with Yamashiro is unclear and the website, alongside the interview, disappeared suddenly and was peculiarly absent from the Internet Archive until somewhat recently.

The text remains verbatim²⁾ except for some minor editing corrections and (hopefully) very minor commentary in the form of footnotes. Photos of Dr. Oohashi left as-is.

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Dr. Tsutomu Ōhashi is, among many other things, a molecular biologist, neuro-scientist, artificial life researcher and pioneer of redefining how the human body senses sound. He is also, at the same time, Shoji Yamashiro. Composer, producer and head of Geinoh Yamashirogumi, the 100-plus member music collective that he founded in 1974.

He has led a life filled with scientific achievement, explorations to remote parts of our planet and is responsible for composing and producing the epic soundtrack to Katsuhiro Otomo’s 1988 anime film AKIRA. Yet, despite these achievements, it is difficult for a “gaijin” to find out anything about him. Which is why I was so honoured that he agreed to meet me in Tokyo this³⁾ April. A well-timed visit, as I was lucky enough to experience one of Yamashirogumi’s rare live performances (a collaborative project with ikebana master Hiroki Ohara) 2 days before a generous 3-hour meeting, during which I tried to find out as much as I could about Dr. Ōhashi’s enigmatic life.

As Tokyo was being lashed by the strongest storm it has experienced in 50 years, I met with Dr. Ōhashi in his pleasant research studio in the western suburbs, warmly welcomed by his unassuming and open demeanour, his scientific colleagues Emi Nishina and Manabu Honda (both also long-time members of Geinoh Yamashirogumi) and the constant stimulus of birdsong from hidden speakers:

TO: So, first we will do this interview, and then we will give you a tour of the audio laboratory and let you experience the Hypersonic effect…

CG: I can’t wait for that.

TO: … and then we can go to have a nice dinner.

CG: I can’t wait for that, either!

TO: So, please explain how you would like to do this interview.

CG: Well, I find that it is extremely difficult for anyone living outside of Japan that is interested in you and your work to learn anything about you, as a person. So, I am interested to find out about you. The work of Yamashirogumi and parts of your scientific research can be sourced on the internet, but for a long time I’ve wanted to learn about your life, how it led to the discoveries and the art that you have made.

TO: Hang on, I’m going to get something to write with, too. You know, it’s funny, because I was very surprised to learn that you were interested in me. You are saying that it is difficult for people outside of Japan to find information about me, but here inside Japan it is difficult also. And difficult to find someone who can understand what I am doing.

CG: Well, I’ll try!

TO: Usually in Japan, many people ask me what I do, what I specialize in, and it is hard to define. Many people see only my work in music and my scientific research as two separate things. But even within the field of science, it is difficult to define exactly what I do. At the moment my work concentrates on Artificial Life theory, but I am always working in different areas of research. Also, I don’t really want to speak about myself to the public much. When I’m contacted to do an interview on the TV, I reject it, I don’t want to disclose much about myself to the public. It’s just my personality.

CG: Then… I’m very honoured that you sat down at a table with me!

EN: Dr. Ōhashi’s current research is not being made public yet, no media knows about it. And when it is made public, it is likely to be nominated for the Nobel Prize⁴⁾. So, to us, for you to be interested in Dr. Ōhashi and his work before this work is even announced, it is a sign that you are genuinely interested in his life.

TO: Also, a large part of my scientific work was only achieved after I had retired from teaching as a Professor. Despite being printed in various international science journals, not many people in Japan were aware of my work. It is usually when you are based in Universities that you write your theses, and it is when you are immersed in the academic world that your work is more noticed and acknowledged upon its release.

CG: You really have accomplished a lot in your long career. But I would really like to start from the beginning. What I see is an impressive and varied array of work, that crosses over from one platform to another. Everything that you have done makes me want to know where and how it all started. You have definitely lived through some interesting times.

TO: Everything probably stems from the core, the essence, of where I come from. I was born in Tochigi prefecture, in 1933, so I will be 80 soon. When I was in the 6th grade of school it was 1945, the year of Japan’s defeat in the Second World War. Up until the start of the war, the beginning of the Showa period, Japan was in a very successful, peace- ful state. And losing World War 2 was probably its first real defeat, it forced Japan as a whole to change its perspective completely. After that, Japan experienced Americanization, Marxism, revolution of the eduction system… So yes, I have lived through some tumultuous times! I grew up in a family of high social status, the son of a high-ranking, pro-war politician. I was leading a comfortable life, until my father was caught and stripped of power, as a war criminal. Overnight I went from being popular and sheltered to being bullied at school. At the same time, my older brother, whom I also respected greatly, was a scientist and suspected Marxist, totally against the war. Complete opposites, but both were a big influence.

CG: Right now, your works within the realms of science and music have fed off of each other, in some instances even fused together. But as children we can see science and music as two very different, separate things. Which were you drawn toward first?

TO: I was exposed to a lot of things at the same time. Before my father was convicted, I was in the environment of a wealthy family home. I was exposed to books, J.S. Bach’s cello sonatas on the record player, and also the scientific interests of my brother… I remember using a microscope to inspect protozoa. It is hard to say which I was interested in first, but I was lucky to be exposed to all those different things. One thing I have always avoided having to do is to categorise what I do. Categories exist solely as a convenience in our lives. I would rather try to live my life without them.

CG: Being an outsider can often give you a broader perspective, do you see yourself as one?

TO: I just feel that people can not decide what they do, or what they want to be. Every day, we live and choose to do what is best at the time. If we strive to do things at the highest level possible, whether it be scientific research or cooking a good meal, these actions decide for us. What I’ve noted is that in our current society we, human beings, are mono-functionalised. Depending on what you “do”, your title is decided. And depending on your title, your activities are controlled. But in reality, our activities are decided by our genes and our brain, not our “title”. I have managed to accomplish a few things that are welcomed by others, I managed to discover some new findings within, and for, our society. But I don’t care what “title” that awards me. Specialists exist in nominal society, but not for any biological reason. They simply exist for the convenience of society. If I were to choose between recognition as a specialist, or simply for my work in the bio-scientific field, I would always take the latter. It’s quite scary to think that freedom of our feeling, sensation and thought is superseded by a system. I personally won’t ignore the rules of our society, I try to be a good citizen, but I won’t let it control what goes on in my head.

CG: So, seeing as there is, and was, this social structure in place, is there a particular reason why you chose to pursue a PhD in Agricultural studies?

TO: In Japan at the time, the field of Agricultural Studies included the study of molecular biology. I was interested in fermentation and mutation on a molecular level. My elder brother was a specialist in this area, so that was a deciding factor, also.

CG: I’ve heard that part of your research whilst gaining your PhD was a study on the compounds that make up LSD. And I would say that the exploration of the human senses is a recurring theme in both your scientific studies and the music you’ve com- posed. Are you conscious of this? Or do you remember where this path originated?

TO: Let me clear on this: I never studied LSD itself, or the effect it has on human beings. I got a PhD for my research on how certain metabolic activity of micro-organisms produces neuro-acting substances, several kinds of Ergot Alkaloids, that can be used to make LSD25. The fact that certain substances can cause a chemical reaction within the brain, which can then, in effect, change how people feel, that interested me. The way that certain synapses in the brain trigger. With music also, I realized during my studies that the essence of music is that sounds can activate certain neural networks and produce pleasure sensations. That the variety in music reflects the variety of networks in our brain that can create pleasure from sound. I became interested in the idea that music containing sounds that can not be scripted or symbolised can activate the brain in this way.

CG: Like gamelan music, which has been known to induce trance-like states?

TO: Exactly. And also I found that brilliant sound engineers could change sounds into all kinds of different forms, which in turn would have different effects on the human brain. The effects of sound are enormous. When I record and produce music, I am conscious of how sound can affect the brain. How the neurotransmitters in the brain work in connection to the sound, which in effect can change how someone feels when listening to it. In terms of when this approach started, I can’t really pin-point it. But for music, I always wanted to avoid concentrating on the “specialists”. The composers, the musicians, their techniques, the musicology… I have always wanted people simply to understand the sound itself. The basis of sound. What effects and feelings that the sounds in music can create, rather than how it was constructed, or why those effects happen. I find that it is because of these “specialists” in the world of music, and the industry that surrounds them, that not only classical music but even popular music is so boring.

CG: Is that why folk musics from various parts of the world have been such an inspiration on the music produced by Geinoh Yamashirogumi?

TO: When I was about 40 years old, I was introduced to Professor Fumio Koizumi, from the Tokyo University of Arts. We connected with a strong mental bond, and it is since meeting him that I have doubted the concept of mono-functionality, people being labelled and categorised into one career path. He introduced me to a great deal of ethnological music, and he suggested that I form an amateur choir, to audition for an NHK broadcast. We performed Bulgarian folk music, and we ended up winning the audition⁵⁾. This instantly made me, technically, a professional musician. I was encouraged by many people in the music and broadcasting industries to concentrate on furthering my career in music, but at the same time I had many people in the scientific world pushing me to concentrate on furthering my research. At this time, what I learned from Professor Koizumi is that music is a mirror of the person playing it. What they play and how they play it is a reflection of who they are and what they stand for, it is a mirror of their life. He had also introduced me to the music of Bali, and how the way that it is played reflects the ideals of the Balinese people as a whole. Multi-functionality is a way of life there.

CG: So you felt a connection with the Balinese way of life, not just Gamelan music? It seems that your explorations into the folk musics of various cultures, and the resulting affinity with them and the cultures they represent, have not only been an influence on the music of Geinoh Yamashirogumi but also your approach to science.

TO: Yes, indeed. After learning of an entire culture based on individuals being multi-disciplined, being free to pursue skills and interests in any direction, I definitely felt an affinity with them. Their culture summarised how I felt at the time, how I wanted to explore as many avenues of thought and action as possible. I had a profound respect for their “strategy” for the construction of human activity. For example, a king of Bali can speak Sanskrit, recite ancient Indian poems, he’s a world-class musician. All Balinese people are adept at music, dancing, painting and crafts, though they are mostly farmers. Professor Koizumi wanted to show me their lifestyle. He hinted at which direction, or directions, my life could take, that I didn’t need to specialise in one field. From then on, it was clear. I had no doubts.

CG: And this first visit to Bali was around the same time as you formed Geinoh Yamashirogumi?

TO: Yes, I first visited Bali in 1973. And I formed Yamashirogumi in 1974. In Bali I had learned Kecak (a Balinese vocal style based on monkey calls) and upon returning to Tokyo I taught the technique to the people that would become Yamashirogumi.

CG: And so Yamashirogumi was formed. All members being working professionals in various fields, joined together by the shared appreciation for indigenous folk music from around the world. I’ve heard that pretty much the only rule the group has is that it can never contain any professional musicians, is that true?

TO: Yes. We love the music, and we are all multi-disciplined. We do not try to gain anything from playing the music, other than the pleasure of playing it.

CG: As well as the initial inspiration from these specific indigenous folk musics, the collective’s early recordings, such as the Osorezan/Do No Kenbai LP, are steeped in other eclectic influences, from traditional Japanese theatrical vocals to jazz and rock. Progressively, on albums such as Ecophony Rinne and Symphonic Suite AKIRA, you seem to have concentrated on the simple, minimal, dramatic sounds of gamelan. I get the feeling that you experimented with a vast array of techniques and sounds early on, but then concentrated on the simple and dramatic sounds of the traditional musics, perfected them, almost as if you are heading back in time, searching for the origins of music itself.

TO: That interpretation could be correct, when listening to the albums that we’ve released. But in fact we play an even more eclectic mix of music now, utilising all that we have learned. I am honoured you mention the fact that we try to perfect the sounds of each traditional music, it is what we try to achieve above all else. And it is true that I am interested in the origins of music. One common factor that every member of Yamashirogumi shares is an interest in the music of the Pygmy, in Africa. In fact a group of us travelled to do intensive field research in Cameroon, Zaire and the Cote d’Ivoire.

EN: We feel that, seeing as the Pygmy are the origins of the human species, their music is the origin of music. And the music they play is wonderful, many of them have a very high level of proficiency at a young age.

MH: They’re like Keith Jarrett or something! And Dr. Ōhashi actually recorded the Pygmy music and released it on the JVC label. In fact, he produced one of the most comprehensive series of ethnic music titles, called JVC Wild Sounds⁶⁾. It consists of over 100 titles. For over 40 of which, Dr. Ōhashi travelled to the source of the music and recorded it himself.

CG: That’s a lot of work! And Dr. Ōhashi, is it true that you have said that you believe music to be ingrained in human DNA?

TO: Haha… Yes, it is true, I said that.

CG: Do you mean in a similar way to how Noam Chomsky said that linguistics are innate and embedded genetically?

TO: I would say my theory differs from that, as it is more biological than anthropological, I see it being associated with natural selection. Very simply put: I feel that people with a talent and/or appreciation for music have survived, and flourished. Therefore, music must be in our genes.

CG: You are very fundamental, in both your musical ventures and your scientific research. You have been involved with KANSEI studies, an area of science almost impossible to describe outside of Japanese culture, which is based in our sensory experience of the world, for over 25 years. Also, your current focus on Artificial Life is hypothesizing and testing some of the most basic yet profound principles possible, such as the death of individual organisms and its effect on the evolution of a species. Do you feel that as you grow older, you are asking more essential questions? Searching for the origins of things?

TO: Broadly speaking, yes. In both music and life itself, I ask the fundamental questions of how and why things have come to exist. We have evolved through the re-writing of genes. Stronger and better genes survive and remain in the system, continuing to produce stronger and better genes. This is emphasized by Darwin’s theory of evolution. But the new interest amongst leading bioscientists is whether this “struggle for existence” is the only factor in evolution. We are currently in the midst of this subject. We see now that the ability to “cooperate” and “contribute” to one another can affect evolution within certain ecosystems. In essence, helping each another can lead to prosperity for cooperative organisms. We found a new evolutionary force. This is proven in our Artificial Life simulations. If the “struggle for existence” is not the only attribute of evolution, we can see wider possibilities and potential in life. This is the hot topic right now. Our recent work has involved using a conceptual apparatus of “altruism” to use mono-cellular organisms to ask fundamental questions regarding a species’ evolutionary acquisition of death.

CG: Is this system of hypothesis in any way based on the Game of Life, the cellular automaton devised by John Horton Conway? I realise that his approach was mathematical, but the concept of setting behavioural guidelines for cells, then studying their evolution, seems similar.

MH: Yes, it uses the mathematical model consisting of automatons based on those developed by Von Neumann in 1948. Essentially, we’ve created artificial ecosystems with extremely heterogenous environmental conditions, then filled them with “immortal” and “mortal” automatons. The interactions between them, and results we have seen, show that the “immortal” species simply survive, whereas “mortal” species’ can adapt, re-write their genetic program and eventually evolve. This is why all life on our planet has death. We want to demonstrate the effectiveness of mortality in evolution.

CG: And these themes of evolution, mutation and survival are very prominent in AKIRA. Also in the music of Yamashirogumi’s 1986 album Ecophony Rinne, which first gained the attention of Katsuhiro Otomo, who then asked you to produce the music for the film adaption of his own manga books. Knowing now that your own scientific ideas were going in the same direction as his creative ones, it must have been a pleasure to work together on that project. Fusing your love for music and your scientific interests.

TO: Oh, it was! The theme of Ecophony Rinne, of biological “recycling” and evolution, was based on the theories we were just talking about. But Otomo-san wasn’t aware of the background of the album. At first he was only impressed by the sounds we created, but then he realised it’s founding in my biological theories and it re-assured us both that we were supposed to work together. If not on AKIRA, it probably would have happened later on another project.

CG: And you were able to share your knowledge of gamelan and other ethnic musics with a new, worldwide audience. Mixing it with the contemporary computer-generated sounds, which contrasted the futuristic and brutal visuals of the film.

TO: We were very limited by time to produce the music for AKIRA, and initially Otomo-san only asked if he could use a part of the existing music from Ecophony Rinne. But then he realised that we could do more than that, and we ended up producing the entire soundtrack. We were very rushed, as he wanted to record the music first, so the voice-overs and the animation could be synched to it. This made the music a real foundation for the film. In fact, after we had recorded the title track, Kaneda, which uses the deep bass sounds of the Balinese jegog (a huge bamboo gamelan instrument), Otomo had it played over loudspeakers in the studio. So there were hundreds of illustrators drawing cells to the same sounds! This really helped create a good atmosphere, with everyone going in the same direction, creatively speaking.

CG: All to the beat of the same drum, like rowers in a ship! And didn’t you end up having to customise mixers and computer software, in order to be able to record the range of sounds created by some of the traditional gamelan instruments?

TO: How do you know that?! Haha… I respect the research you have done, somehow learning of my studies on LSD compounds and my recording techniques, but now you’ve got me a little scared!⁷⁾ Yes, we had to modify things a little to re-create the sound faithfully. We constructed a special jegog, one which produces 5 notes per octave, rather than gamelan’s traditional 4. And the computer software that we used to record the music had to be customised. Because time was so limited we developed a Sound Module System, where we grouped together all of the music that we recorded into a multi-track system that could be utilised later on, using the mixer at the mastering stage. We could compose various kinds of music simultaneously. When the tempo was set, the system would follow certain patterns and rules, never producing the same series of sounds more than once.

CG: That was pretty innovative for 1988. And would you say that composing and recording Symphonic Suite AKIRA was one way in which your experience in music has had a direct effect on your scientific research? Is it what led you to discovering the Hypersonic Effect?

TO: Oh yes. And it is also true with Ecophony Rinne, which was initially recorded for JVC with the capabilities of the then-new CD format in mind. They asked me to test the boundaries of what the format could do, in comparison to LP’s. That included duration time, dynamic range, recording techniques, sound quality, things that were only possible with the CD format. This was at the time of transition between the LP and CD formats. Not many people even owned a CD player, with the majority still listening to vinyl. So we ended up releasing more LPs than CDs anyway. Also, the listeners weren’t the only ones limited by technology, we didn’t even have the facilities needed to record the album digitally! It was mastered on analog, so despite the initial idea of championing the CD format, we ended up with an album that had great sound quality on the LP format and sounded like crap on CD. I was very disappointed. The reason was that a CD is only capable of recording up to a 20khz frequency level, as opposed to 100khz on an LP. Not many people knew of this at the time, as there was no device to measure it.

CG: I never knew the scientific reason, but maybe that’s why I only have LPs. I always preferred the sound quality.

TO: Well, that’s really good for your health. Through the Hypersonic Effect!

CG: I was wondering why those records made me so happy! And so, it was sensing the difference between the sound quality of the same recording on these two different formats that led to your eventual discovery of the Hypersonic Effect?

TO: Yes, I needed to find out what the difference was.

EN: So we prepared three kinds of sound material: CD sound, LP sound and that same LP sound subjected to a hi-end filter. We then measured the brainwave activity of subjects exposed to each of these audio tracks. We found that not only the brain activity was drastically different, but also the verbal responses of the subject. Across the board, the CD and hi-end filtered LP sound had the same level of appreciation, but with the LP sounds including the full spectrum of high-frequencies the subject always gave a more positive response. The tones were “softer” or “warmer” or “natural”. Then, after seeing significantly more brain activity during exposure to the LP sound, we concluded that the rich high-frequency components should be included in all recordings, for increased pleasure. And it was after we achieved an accurate replication of the rich-frequency sounds present in LP recordings through digital mastering, and then tested them as before, that we realised the Hypersonic Effect was still present.

MH: And it was due to this research that Sony, Bandai Visual and Dolby approached Dr. Ōhashi for his assistance in designing the audiological specs for the Blu-ray disc.

CG: I admire the fact that you want to capture sound in all its glory. As you said earlier, sound can have an impressive effect on the human brain. And I can’t help but think that perhaps your exposure to gamelan music, which is a music created with instruments known to produce sounds containing extremely high-frequencies, might have inspired you to start down this path of research.

TO: Actually, it was the opposite! First, I experienced an unusual phenomenon in a recording studio, back at the time we were mastering our recording for JVC. I found that when I enhanced the supposedly inaudible frequencies on the mixing desk, that the quality of the sounds I was listening to changed drastically. At that time, in the field of audiological science, there were standardised international guidelines that denied the possibility of this happening, due to the fact that the human ear can’t sense sounds over those levels. The tests that had been made at institutions here in Japan and Germany, that set the standards for the development of the CD format, contradicted what I sensed. But I knew that I had sensed a difference in the quality of the sound.

CG: And so you set about proving them wrong?

TO: I just wanted to know the science behind the sensation that I had felt. But, at the time, there was no portable measuring equipment available that was capable of analysing sounds containing these rich high-frequency components. Before this, I had been recording the music of various ethnic groups around the world for JVC, and I had been exposed to a great deal of music containing these high-frequency components. So, when I needed to choose audio samples as test material for my research, I simply chose the gamelan music, instinctively. The “taste” of the sound was very close to the effect that I had experienced in the studio. That was in the 1980s. It wasn’t until the 1990s that the necessary measuring equipment became available, in the shape of a portable spectral analyzer, which revealed that the gamelan music I had chosen on a hunch was actually the perfect example to prove my theories.

MH: The data proved his hunch was correct. Which is something we experience a lot when working with him. He often points out the correct answer at the beginning, without any reason. We often continue research simply to confirm that he was correct!

CG: That reminds me of the way Richard Feynman seemed to always know the answers before his colleagues even knew the questions. He was also a bit of an outsider in the scientific world. Which leads me to wonder, Dr. Ōhashi, if you have, or had, any peers or scientists from outside of Japan that have had a great influence on you and your work?

TO: No, Nobody. I’ve never really liked the competitive nature of the scientific world. I’ve never worshipped anybody, and never truly cared about the accomplishments of others. I guess I have always believed that everything is already written for us, in our DNA. I don’t want to create something new, I simply want to find what is already there, embedded in myself. Accurately. But I’m honoured that you have drawn a comparison between Dr. Feynman and myself. There are definitely some common factors there. Thinking about it, I would say now that the people that have influenced me the most are the Pygmies in Africa. Their genes represent human innate DNA most correctly. The reason I say that is because the origins of the human species go back 20 million years, into the tropical rainforest, where the orangutan and gorilla were the precursors to our evolution. That was our original and most natural environment, where we should have stayed. Obviously the reality is a different story. We have evolved into a species capable of adaptation, and war. So yes, I respect the pygmies, because they epitomise how the human species could, or perhaps should, have stayed.

CG: And in a way science, through it’s founding in curiosity, takes us further away from that perfect, natural state.

TO: Exactly. That is, or should be, the conundrum for any scientist. In research, there is always fear of analysing too much. But I feel unbiased discovery is necessary. It is important to prove something, to learn of our origins.

CG: And of course, have respect for what you are analysing. Which seems to be the foundation of your scientific approach. You have a habit of making breakthroughs in fields that you initially admired and were inspired by, clearly you have a deep interest in the many different cultures you have encountered on your recording and research trips. Actually, someone told me at the concert two days ago that you have an impressive collection of masks that you collected from of these voyages.

TO: Indeed, I do. I have many masks. And I ended up making some discoveries through them, too! I never intended to study them scientifically, I started collecting them simply to appreciate their aesthetics, but I became aware of an interesting phenomenon. I noticed a similarity in masks used at the climax stage of ceremonial performances from Bali, Japan and all over Asia. Regardless of what animal the masks represent, or the colours they are decorated with, their expression was very similar. The muscular positions and facial expressions all mimic the fierce territorial display of an animal, the ethological pattern of threat. I had read some studies from the 1960s based on animal territoriality and the expressions they use, then realised that these mask have existed for over 500 years. Why would these celebrations, happy occasions, come to a climax using masks portraying angry, threatening animals? It was natural for all these separated cultures to use these scary masks to create the finale in their celebrations.

CG: But how could it be a good thing, to end a celebration with frightening characters such as these?

TO: When the crowd sees these masks rushing towards them, it stimulates the production of beta-endorphins and serotonin in their brains. It makes them feel good.

CG: Like a horror movie?

MH: Kind of. In essence it is the origins of what we would call “fear”. It is closely linked to the way the brain feels pleasure sensation.

TO: The fact that all of these cultures, who were at the time unaware of one another, used the same method of inducing pleasure through fear, using the same means, shows that it is a phenomenon founded in genetics, not culture. There is a Japanese saying that roughly translates to: “You don’t want to look… But you have to look!”. We want to challenge our- selves. We should. And in relation to the masks themselves, I feel that only things that challenge our ideals of what beauty is can be called art. I classify art in general into three categories: Pure art, which provides an initial pleasure sensation. Progressive art, when a pleasure sensation can be found after studying and appreciating different levels of a work. Then, art which gives no real pleasure sensation, despite searching for one. This category includes most contemporary pop music, for which I would say anyone that experiences a pleasure sensation has a malfunctioning brain! I think the current definition of art needs to be revised. For example, avant-garde music, since the 1930s, has been produced based on the theory that good art is essentially anything created that hasn’t existed before. This is trying to get as far away as possible from what our genetics and brains actually want to experience.

CG: Talking about these masks and ritualistic ceremonies from around the world, I’m thinking about something you mentioned before. When you explained how the synapses of the brain can be affected not only by synthetic compounds, such as LSD, but also compounds produced naturally, within our own bodies. Have you had any experience with people using drugs or music to enter trances?

TO: Actually, we had the pleasure of studying a tribe in Bali that used the original technique of achieving a trance-like state during certain rituals, without using any drugs at all. Only the effects of the gamelan music. In fact, it was the hard work of our colleague Dr. Norie Kawai that allowed us to do this. It took over 10 years to convince them to participate, she went as a student of Balinese traditional dance and spent so much effort learning their ways and earning their trust that they allowed us to monitor them during a ritual dance.

CG: How on earth did you accomplish that? I mean, how do you scientifically monitor such a frenetic and chaotic event?

TO: We had to customise portable EEG brain measurement equipment, for them to wear during the dance, so they had tiny digital sensors attached to the heads⁸⁾, and we took blood samples before and after to measure dopamine, noradrenaline and beta-endorphin levels. The results from the audience members that entered a trance were off the chart. The endorphin levels were 10-times greater. Their psychological state can be proven by the brain maps and blood results. I also took many, many photos.

CG: I get the feeling that, spanning across your music and various fields of science, all of your work is founded in perception and how we experience the world fundamentally. So, when you play gamelan music, is it purely for the pleasurable experience of it? Or can you start to analyse the music a little too much?

TO: First and foremost it is for the pleasure. For myself, and all Yamashirogumi members, it starts with a shared pleasure in playing the music. But when we repeatedly experience these different musics, we inevitably become interested in their backgrounds, cosmology or the lifestyles of the people that originally played it. And you know, when learning these things, sometimes brain science can… help.

CG: And so, alongside your scientific advancements, how do you hope to further your music? Do you still want to compose your own original music, or are you concentrating more on the appreciation and interpretation of musics that have existed for tens of thousands of years?

TO: I never really thought about which direction I was going in. Maybe I have a Buddhist approach, because I never intended to create something new. I simply like to take what already exists, try to avoid spoiling its original form, and somehow introduce it in a way that can be most appreciated. The word “creative” never really sank into me. But that doesn’t mean I have nothing that I want to achieve. In developing music, there is a clear goal for me, and it is founded in the Hypersonic Effect. The way I see it, all music up until now has contained the rich high-end frequencies that further stimulate our brain. It is only the limitations of recordable formats that stop us from experiencing the positive effects these inaudible frequencies have. Now that I under- stand these effects, I believe that all music should utilise their potential, and I hope to create music that stimulates the listener as much as possible.

CG: I can’t wait to hear it! And I have one more question: I came into this interview with an idea of you having a “duality”. Of you working in the two seemingly different worlds of music and science, using a different persona for each. Then, within the first five minutes, I realised that is not the case. Your approach to music and science weaves them into one other. But then why, if this is the case, do you use your pseudonym of Shoji Yamashiro?

TO: Haha… This might not be as sophisticated an answer as you might expect! Let’s just say that a young scientific researcher at college isn’t expected to perform kecak in his spare time, and I never wanted to waste time unnecessarily having to explain myself to others, so I thought of using the name of somebody I knew as a pseudonym.

CG: You knew him??

TO: Well, actually it was a woman! She was called Shoko Yamashiro. It would’ve been a little too obvious to use a full name, so I took her’s and used the male version. It was just as a convenience, really.

After this conversation, Dr. Ōhashi took the time to show me around his audio research laboratory, where I experienced the Hypersonic Effect first-hand. Sensing a clear difference in sound quality between audio files with and without the rich high-end frequencies included, audio files including monotone test frequencies and Heart’s “All I wanna do is make love to you”. Also, when exposed to audio utilising the Hypersonic Effect, I felt a subtle warm, fuzzy feeling on my arms and face. Apparently this is normal, and seeing as it only occurs on exposed areas of the body, perhaps it is indicative of how the human body “hears” sound with not only our ears.

Later, in an understated restaurant near the studio that Dr. Ōhashi has frequented for over 30 years, I couldn’t help speaking of the anticipation of thousands of Geinoh Yamashirogumi fans. Over possibly the tastiest meal I have ever eaten, I asked him when Shoji Yamashiro’s next, eagerly awaited album would be introduced to the world. It’s been a while. Apparently, he has a history of only producing creative works after being asked to do a project. Well, Dr. Ōhashi, I am officially asking you now: “Please, make a new album for us. We would like your music to light-up our brain maps like Christmas trees.”